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2:39 pm
April 27, 2008
Online
Matt, once again I appreciate the debate here. This is important!
Based on what you are talking about here and after reading your numbers, I see that you should have gone back through level 1 before moving to level 2. I advise everyone to continue with Level 1 until your power clean has exceeded your body weight by at least 15 lbs or more. Also do not move into level 2 until you have at least been through the entire level 1 program for an 8 week cycle.
The point is the Level 1 program is the bread and butter of 3X Pitching. You are going to see your most gains in this program. I will work harder on level 3 or I may actually improve level 2 to create a program that allows us to double our gains from level 1 but if I am able to create this perfect program then it will definitely be the million dollar program. This is why I appreciate this debate and you pushing me here. I will use this to make the level 2 and beyond 3X programs even better.I promise!
Just take my advice here and go back into level 1 and make sure you complete everything and get that powerclean going, this will be the key for you. I also have my 3X Pre-season program launching this week or next with some awesome 3X drills for improving your pitching mechanics.
3:42 pm
Rookie
June 6, 2011
Offline
Hi Matt,
1- I was busting chops on the justin verlander thread, as it still cracks me up!
2- Thanks for responding and there is nothing wrong with giving feedback on the program
3- I dont have the level 2 program, my son just completed level 1 and is going to re-cycle through level 1 before tryouts start. more on that point later…
4- If the title of brents program was "Powerlifting: How to Increase your 1 rep max by 30% in 16 Weeks or less", I would agree with you 100%. I would look at Simmons, Wendler, Westside, 531, TNT or other programs. I would assume level 2 is balancing strength and mobility and is specific to pitching not powerlifting.
5- The gains you acheived after 16 weeks of level 1 are pretty insane. In fact, if you did a pure powerlifting program you may not have acheived those type of numbers. Its even more amazing considering you only did about 60-67% of the course. This maybe the reason you struggled with level 2. You may have not been ready for it. Also consider that at some point you do reach certain limits with weights and the rate of gain declines.
6- to tie in with point 5. My son has not reached his body weight with the bench or clean and is under 300 on the squat. But thats okay, because he still busts his balls and I dont expect him to be another Trevor Bauer in 16 weeks. I understand a kid his age will struggle alot more than someone your age with strength gains. So he is going to cycle through level 1 again and not do level 2.
I dont have an inseason program (hint, hint, hint), so I am probably going to modify level 1 and use part of the drills, target throws, conditioning, joint integrity: strip it down and use lower reps on the days between appearances for an inseason version.
Good luck, and Brent is probably weighing in as i finish this novel anyway!
3:45 pm
Rookie
June 6, 2011
Offline
yep,
he weighed in already, so my apologies if I re-stated his opinions………………..
Mule,
I re-read your post and I "get" what you are saying. Your thinking:
pre-3x to 16 weeks
velocity: +6
clean: +40
bench: +10
sguat: +30
Wow! This is the balls!!!!
Level 2:
velocity: -2
clean: +5
bench: +10
sguat: +5
Hey! WTF happened here!!!
If level 2 has some kick butt anerobics and you completely skipped this portion of level 1 your declines maybe the result of overtraining. In other words, you did not have a solid base established first and you moved up too fast. This is not uncommon. You dont run a marathon right out of the gate. You build up to it with 5k and 10k runs first.
4:19 pm
Rookie
June 20, 2011
Offline
One more thing. Before the program I weighed 158. After 16 weeks I weighed 167. All of it was muscle which is a good thing since I really needed some more mass. I appreciate that you will re-evaluate level 2. That's the reason this program is so much better than any others, it is constantly evolving. I will definitely go back to level 1 after the spring season but right now I'm just trying to salvage anything I can get right now.
The main thing I improved on was my clean. I've had a strong base with power lifting so the others were really just getting back to where I was my freshman year. The reason I'm so pro power lifting is because of when I was in 7th grade. I was ranked 44th athlete in my grade. The tests to determine this were: bench, squat, power clean, vertical, and 40 time. I had been doing general lifting and running before but I just wasn't very athletic. I started using the program found on http://www.bearpowered.com and in 3 months I was 19th. I deadlifted 225 pounds in between my 7th and 8th grade year when I weighed 112 pounds. By the time I was a freshman I was ranked 4th. I deadlifted 315 pounds, ran a 4.8 second 40 yard dash, and benched 165, while weighing only 130. Then I had the injury and it ended that. So I'm not your average high school kid when it comes to lifting experience.
As you can read from an earlier post I do believe that the power clean is the key to converting strength into the power needed to throw hard.
And yes, level 2 has a very, very intense cardio work out.
6:33 pm
Rookie
June 20, 2011
Offline
Yep, that pretty much sums up my thoughts haha.
I like how you mentioned the build up process because it's very true. But, and this is what I've been getting at over and over, how much is enough for a pitcher? And at what point does it conflict with our fast twitch and ultimately velocity?
6:35 pm
Rookie
June 20, 2011
Offline
Urg, I don't know how to get what I said out of the quote but oh well, you know what I said and what you said.
7:40 pm
April 27, 2008
Online
Matt,
What you are also learning is that the Level 2 program is a 3 day lifting program and a 2 day throwing program. Obviously with your lifting background you have done more lifting than throwing. This is why in the level 2 program you did not experience velocity gains. This tells you that you need to spend more time in the throwing program at this point in your development. I have had guys go through the level 2 program who has not lifted much beside with the 3X programs and have continued to see the gains.This also tells me that you will do well with the 3X pre-season program because it doubles the throwing volume and cuts in half the lifting volume.
7:45 pm
Minor Leaguer
August 28, 2011
Offline
I guess you can say from this article http://www.hulsestrength.com/5…..gth-speed/ that from the 4th step that transitioning the strength and speed you accumulate in the weight room into the field. Which is why working in the 50%-60% range is needed. I get that of course working with lower reps does increase strength and speed somewhat faster?? but you need to be able to transfer it onto the field :D.
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