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	<title>Topvelocity.net&#187; extreme distances</title>
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		<title>3X Pitching Superior to Extreme Long Toss</title>
		<link>http://www.topvelocity.net/3x-pitching-superior-to-extreme-long-toss/</link>
		<comments>http://www.topvelocity.net/3x-pitching-superior-to-extreme-long-toss/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 May 2011 18:02:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Brent Pourciau</dc:creator>
				<category><![CDATA[Pitching Articles]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[alan jaeger]]></category>
		<category><![CDATA[american sports medicine]]></category>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://topvelocity.net/?p=3373</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The argument behind extreme long toss is that the pitcher will learn how to take the velocity of a 300 foot throw and transfer it into a 60 foot throw. This is what I learned from watching an interview with Alan Jaeger who uses extreme long toss with yoga to develop pitchers. If you have [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img class="alignnone size-medium wp-image-3377" style="float: right; margin: 5px;" title="long-tossing-3x" src="http://up.topvelocity.net/uploads/2011/05/long-tossing-3x-300x151.jpg" alt="3X VS Long Toss" width="300" height="151" />The argument behind extreme long toss is that the pitcher will learn how to take the velocity of a 300 foot throw and transfer it into a 60 foot throw. This is what I learned from watching an interview with Alan Jaeger who uses extreme long toss with yoga to develop pitchers.</p>
<p>If you have been following this site then you know that I am totally against this approach to pitching. Here is a quick summary of why I am against this type of training. The American Sports Medicine Institute (ASMI) proves in their latest case study <a href="http://topvelocity.net/asmi-vs-alan-jaeger-in-long-toss-study/">here</a> that this type of long toss creates elbow varus torque in the arm and uses different mechanics than those used on the mound. In defence, Alan Jaeger says that the athletics of the 300 foot throw when restricted to 60 feet, through his &#8220;Pull Down&#8221; phase, forces the pitcher to be more open and explosive.<span id="more-3373"></span> The reason that the revolutionary approach to pitching velocity, 3X Pitching, is far superior to this extreme long toss approach is because the 3X approach defines each component of its 3X Pitching Mechanics and uses drills and a complete training program to train the pitcher to implement these mechanics into their delivery, without abusing the arm. Alan Jaeger&#8217;s program never seems to mention anything about good mechanics. This is a major reason why I am against his extreme long toss and speak out against it, because if you do not have good mechanics when building your throws to 300 feet, you are extremely vulnerable to injury as proven in the ASMI case study and the reason why ASMI advises against this type of training. Another big reason is the fact that what he is trying to teach athletically, through his extreme long toss program, can be done without putting the pitcher through this type of rotator cuff and elbow abuse.</p>
<p>If Alan Jaeger understood the mechanics of this own training then he would learn that throwing long toss at extreme distances trains the pitcher to build elastic energy early in the delivery. This means it forces the pitcher to get good external rotation in the arm, along with building elastic energy through the chest cavity and hip flexors early. This occurs because the trajectory of release is a lot higher than throwing off of the mound, which forces the pitcher to throw the ball behind the front leg. Alan Jaeger then attempts to correct this mechanical flaw by taking these mechanics through his &#8220;Pull Down&#8221; phase, down to 60 feet, which forces the pitcher to finish over the front leg. This would be a good approach if he used good mechanics to keep pitchers safe from this extreme training. Just like it is critical to have good lifting mechanics when training to get bigger, stronger and faster but the main reason that 3X Pitching is a far superior approach to pitching velocity is because it trains the pitcher to do the same as an extreme long toss program without putting the abuse on the arm. This is why 3X Pitching wins hands down!</p>
<p>In the 3X Pitching Velocity Program the medicine ball drills are training the pitcher to develop elastic energy early in the delivery as effectively as extreme long toss but you are only throwing the 2 lb med ball 40 feet while focusing to hit all of the 3X Mechanics. You then take these mechanics into the target throws with the 5 ounce baseball. This is why 3X Pitching is so effective in increasing velocity and it is injury free. With Alan Jaeger&#8217;s extreme long toss program, I know he can not say the same!</p>
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		<title>The Adventures of Long Tossing!</title>
		<link>http://www.topvelocity.net/the-adventures-of-long-tossing/</link>
		<comments>http://www.topvelocity.net/the-adventures-of-long-tossing/#comments</comments>
		<pubDate>Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:09:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<dc:creator>Brent Pourciau</dc:creator>
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		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://topvelocity.net/?p=2135</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Long tossing has been a heated debate on Topvelocity.net in the past month. The day I posted my first article against the practice of &#8220;Extreme Long Tossing&#8221; I was contacted by Alan Jaeger with Jaeger Sports. Lets just say he wasn&#8217;t happy with my research. The problem is Alan Jaeger and I have totally different [...]]]></description>
			<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><img class="alignnone size-medium wp-image-2136" style="float: right; margin: 5px;" title="toss" src="http://up.topvelocity.net/uploads/2010/01/toss-300x213.jpg" alt="" width="300" height="213" />Long tossing has been a heated debate on Topvelocity.net in the past month. The day I posted my first article against the practice of &#8220;Extreme Long Tossing&#8221; I was contacted by Alan Jaeger with Jaeger Sports. Lets just say he wasn&#8217;t happy with my research. The problem is Alan Jaeger and I have totally different back grounds. He played a little college baseball and I played a little pro baseball. Jaeger is a yoga instructor and I am a strength and conditioning specialist. It isn&#8217;t that I do not agree with everything he teaches, I just don&#8217;t agree with a lot of it but that is the best part about the internet. We can all have our own opinions and programs.<span id="more-2135"></span></p>
<p>The article on TopVelocity.net that has been getting a lot of attention and the one that Jaeger is not happy with, is the article called <a href="http://topvelocity.net/long-toss-and-the-placebo-effect/">Long Toss and the Placebo Effect</a>. You can view it by selecting the title. The comments are below the article. Everyone thinks that I am against Long Tossing and the truth is that this isn&#8217;t true. I believe in Long Tossing up to about 120 feet. What I DO NOT agree with is &#8220;Extreme Long Tossing&#8221; like Jaeger promotes which can exceed distances of 350 feet. I feel that this is reckless because if you do not have efficient throwing mechanics you are taking a big risk with the health of your arm at these levels. This is why I preach against Jaeger&#8217;s Long Toss program because he does not work intently on correcting mechanical flaws before pushing his pitchers to these extreme distances. A great example is Joel Zumaya. This is Jaeger&#8217;s claim to fame whom he has put all over his website. Just this past MLB season Joel Zumaya broke off his shoulder bone. This is a major mechanical flaw that caused Zumaya&#8217;s shoulder bone to snap and you would hope his pitching coach could have prevented this major shoulder injury. If I was his pitching coach I would have at least taking responsibility for his injury.</p>
<p>Another reason I do not support this &#8220;Extreme Long Tossing&#8221; is because I like many other pro pitchers did not use this in my professional career. Actually before I tore my rotator cuff in college, I would perform extreme long toss. I am not saying that this is why I injured my arm. What I am saying is I never used it again and was able to add 8 mph on my fastball which got me into pro ball.</p>
<p>The day I broke 90+mph post surgery, which I had at 18 years old when I was throwing 86 mph with horrendous mechanics, is because of a new program I was on for about 6 months to a year. The day I found this program was the day I decided to stop making this stuff up and seek professional help from those who I felt knew what they were talking about. I found Tom House who is a well known pitching coach and Doctor and Kurt Hester who is a nationally recognized strength and conditioning specialist. Tom House taught me about hip to shoulder separation, which I had none and Kurt taught me speed and strength like you wouldn’t believe. With this combination I experienced an 8 mph increase in velocity.</p>
<p>I wasn’t long tossing past 250 feet plus. I wasn’t using weighted balls. I was performing the Olympic lifts, plyos, and sprint work, 1 hour a day, 5 days a week while I was playing for a travel team in the summer. If I pitched on a day of a lift, I would not change my program. I would lift at full intensity and then pitch a 7-9 inning game one hour later. This is because the lifting program was lower body dominate. I wasn’t pounding my arms. I was pounding my legs. I also was working on good hip to shoulder separation during practice and before the games. I thought at this time, that with the lifting intensity and the pitching of 7-9 innings that my body would give out and it did the opposite. I would finish a 9 inning game with higher velocities than in the first inning. I continued this program and it is what I believe put me into pro ball after doctors told me I would never be able to compete again.</p>
<p>The program I used is now the <a href="http://topvelocity.net/ace-pitcher-handbook/">Ace Pitcher Handbook</a>. I am aware that this program isn’t for everyone and that just because it worked for me, doesn&#8217;t mean it will work for you. I understand this but you will never know if a program like this will have the same effect on you if you don’t give it your best.</p>
<p>I also believe that the reason arm injuries have increased by 700% in the past ten years is because pitchers are training outside of the mechanics of the pitcher. Extreme long toss mechanics is a lot different than on the mound mechanics. I explain this here</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.topvelocity.net/the-proper-research-on-why-long-toss-is-bad-for-your-arm/">The Proper Research on Why Long Toss is Bad for your Arm</a></p>
<p>This is also the case in the weight room. This is why I believe the Olympic lifts are the only intense lifts you should use because they have a lot of similarities in mechanics to pitching. You can read more about this point in the first article I wrote on this site.</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="../olympic-velocity/">Olympic lifting Increases Pitching Velocity.</a></p>
<p>I am glad that &#8220;Extreme Long Tossing&#8221; is getting this much attention with this site and Jaeger&#8217;s but I hope that those who are using this approach are educating themselves on the dangers. I also hope those who use my approach are educating themselves on the dangers as well. Which are, just like learning good throwing mechanics before you try to throw your arm off you must learn good lifting mechanics  before you try to move a house. Be smart, work hard and always listen to your body!</p>
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