Jesuit Coach Latino of 193 Pitch Game Defies Anybody to Prove Him Wrong | Talk Pitching | TopVelocity Baseball Forum
April 27, 2008
The pitch count controversy down here in Louisiana has been at my front door because one of the pitchers who was a part of this controversial game is one of the guys I have been working with since he was 16. When I heard Mitchell Sewald had thrown 154 pitches in this game I was upset but not shocked because I knew his coach was capable of this. The more shocking part was on the other team. The Jesuit Coach Joey Latino kept his pitcher Emerson Gibbs in the game for 15 innings which came to 193 pitches. This again was shocking but even more shocking was when I saw the interview Coach Latino did in defense of his decision to leave Gibbs in the game. He does say that the 193 pitch count was indefensible but he then contradicts himself by saying:
“Gibbs has impeccable mechanics and his delivery is low stress….
I defy anybody to look at the tape of the game and say oh yeah he was definitely struggling there in the late innings because he simple wasn’t…”
You can watch the entire interview here:
I would like to step up to the plate here and take Coach Latino up on his challenge. I have looked at the tape and Gibbs is definitely struggling with his mechanics the entire game. He has the infamous inverted W. It is obvious this coach, along with the thousands of others, do not know what “impeccable” mechanics are. The reason is because they do not study the skill. Most do not use video to slow down deliveries so they have no idea, like in the case of Gibbs, that the inverted W exists.
It is obvious here, in this one frame above from the entire 15 inning game, that Gibbs has the infamous inverted W which has plagued or ended the careers of MLB pitchers like Kerry Woods, Anthony Reyes, Stephen Strausburg, Mark Prior and many more.
Here is a close up of Emerson Gibbs displaying his inverted W.
I do not blame Coach Joey Latino for Gibb’s inverted W but I do blame him for not seeing this as a mechanical flaw in his delivery and also for throwing him for 193 pitches with this serious issue.
As a former pitcher, I am not a big fan of pitch counts because I loved throwing a lot of pitches in a game but I strictly believe in the pitch count as a coach today because I know that most coaches are like Coach Latino and have a very average to below average understanding of good pitching mechanics and how to train the pitcher, so a pitch count restriction is the only way to protect these young pitchers from these uneducated coaches ruining their careers.
If you have never heard of this inverted W terminology before I recommend reading this article:
July 16, 2011
Here is an interesting round table on ESPN Boston about the subject.
May 1, 2012
While I suppose some of these points are well taken to those who are not well versed in the matter and thus look good as a marketing perspective for your services, you fail to prove many of your points.
For starters, Kerry Woods, Anthony Reyes, Stephen Strausburg, and Mark Prior are all major league pitchers. It safe to presume they all have been pitching for numerous years. However, to say an injury caused by an inverted W “plagued or ended the careers” of these pitchers is unwarranted and unproven. Unless one has followed each of those men around in his everyday life and observed any and all other possible movements or lack of movements that could cause an injury, it’s a bold statement to claim their pitching style was the precise cause of what you called their “plagued or ended” careers. In addition, it seems essential to be a medical doctor who specializes in similar injuries to make a statement with any credibility.
Furthermore, there has been no definitive proof that an inverted W is any more strenuous than any other pitching style. However, assuming there was credible proof, isn’t it likely that major league pitching coaches, people who get paid for a living to correct and preserve their players, would have corrected Kerry Woods, Anthony Reyes, Stephen Strausburg, and Mark Prior. The fact that they each have played for different teams with different coaches only further suggests that major league pitching coaches do not find this style of an inverted W to be harmful.
With that conclusion in place and recognizing your endorsement of your coach services regarding pitching, it appears you are suggesting you have more knowledge than a major league pitching coach. Now, I’ve never met you before nor am I familiar at all with your services, but I presume if you were more knowledgeable and skilled than a major league coach, you would opt to reap the benefits of the salary and fame of a major league coach rather than mess around online diminishing the performance of a high school pitcher. Aside from your questionable scrutiny of a minor, Gibbs pitched a phenomenal game from start to end and was recognized positively by several independent sources for his performance.
Because I am unfamiliar with your services, I do not claim you are not a competent coach. However, I am suggesting that you need some work on your marketing skills. Making baseless claims will only tarnish your credibility for your true attributes. Good luck.
April 27, 2008
Thanks for posting Mr. BaseballFan. I am sorry that the fact that I am a pitching instructor and not a Major League Pitching coach bothers you and I now understand that you have little respect for us pitching instructors. I guess that makes you either a frustrated baseball fan or a really frustrated high school coach.
You obviously didn’t read the article that I posted below my comments above. If you would have read the article you would have come across my quote that says:
Unfortunately, there has been zero studies to date on this so called, “Red Flag.”
The “Red Flag” was in reference to the inverted W. Even though the inverted W terminology has not been used in a case study to date you can not say this mechanical flaw is “unwarranted.” Just recently ESPN posted an article on the rise in UCL surgeries and referenced the “inverted W” as an unhealthy mechanical flaw that may be the cause of these injuries. They even quoted a pitching instructor about this issue. Here is the article:
You can try to discredit me and even spin the topic here but you will never be able to get away from the inverted W debate because it is an obvious link to elbow and shoulder injuries. If Coach Latino was completely aware of this controversy I would like to believe that he would have never pitched Emerson Gibbs 193 pitches in one game nor would he have made the comments that his mechanics are “impeccable.” This is only because I have a little more respect than you for people who are not Doctors or Major League Coaches.
Hiding behind the name BaseballFan when you discredit me on my website is cowardly.
August 28, 2011
Yes, as a baseball fan, I don’t think you should be arguing to pitching instructors or coaches about how their philosophy is bad, but loving the game and what makes the game. Without instructors or coaches, no one would know how to play baseball. Sometimes you’ve got to toughen up a little and deal with it, which is what we have done to all the other coaches. Now, even of there is no evidence, the fact that all these major leaguers have the nverted W and have hurt their arms compared to those without, you can see the difference. Also, not just us are saying the inverted W is bad, coaches like Paul Reddick says that it’s bad too.
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