Weight Training Pitchers - Agreeing to disagree | Page 5 | Talk Velocity | TopVelocity Baseball Forum
March 12, 2012
April 27, 2008
Finally, you have decided to provide some substance to your banter. You believe genetics and strength training having nothing to do with pitching velocity. Is this correct? You are saying that physics has the answers. I would love to discuss the physics of pitching with you bezball25. Can you explain to me your belief of the physics behind pitching velocity?
June 20, 2011
Wow, chill out. This site is completely dedicated to physics driven velocity. Read five articles on this site and you can see that science (physics to be exact) is the back bone of the program. They may give him one inch, I'll let you have that. But for him to be 140 pounds? Thats a stretch. I would bet a lot of money that he is not that small. He would have to make an effort to weigh that little. Sure, genetics aren't everything, but they give you a huge head start. He has probably put in a ton of work in addition to his natural ability.
You need to open your eyes and quit being so ignorant and big headed. And please stop telling people to shut up, no one has told you to shut up even though we definitely have more of a reason to.
August 28, 2011
Look. I believe the way here is not just to insult other people's belief. It's good that we're trying to correct his philosophy, but if he doesn't want to believe it, then he won't be the one experiencing the “thing”. It's like me, as a christian, I want to be able to spread the gospel to everyone out there so that they may go to heaven. But on the other hand, those that don't believe it will be the ones that will be cut off. It's up to him what he wants to believe, which is why I like Brent's approach when he says that he wants to discuss it rather than trying to force him to believe that our way is right. But here, I am just trying to state my opinion so that he can evaluate on what he may have been teaching wrong. So let's get back onto the topic XD. I want to just answer a question posed from the first few comments. I KNOW TONS OF PLAYERS WHO HAVE WENT TO OTHER PROGRAMS BECAUSE TRIPLE EXTENSION IS NOT THE WAY TO VELOCITY. NOT ONLY THAT BUT HEAVY WEIGHT TRAINING WAS PROVEN TO WORK THE OPPOSITE. I believe the reason why players went to other programs is not because 3X is not the way to velocity, but because it's not giving them success instantly. Some people will think when they buy the program, it will do the work for you, and you can gain success overnight. Also, most successful pitchers in the MLB are successful because they can command the ball to move however they want. 3X is not an accuracy based program. Just stick that into your heads. I believe people are lacking in their success just because they lack control, and when they go to a “velocity” program, they don't gain anything much from it. Or rather, they still aren't getting success. Because 3X is a developmental program it takes time to gain success. Same with any other program out there. You say that a player never weight trains, well fast twitch training is generally similar to any kind of strength training, so even if a player is not strength training, he could be doing like plyos everyday. Simply the result is the same, but the time taken is different. It's the saying where, you have a friend who wants to go the city, you both take two very different routes, but where do you end up? in the same destination. The time taken could vary, but they're wanting to reach the same spot. It's the same with strength training, or just regular fast twitch training. They lead to the very same place, but they're two different routes. Now to the next part. There are some common myths out there that young developing athletes shouldn’t resistance train because it could stunt their growth, damage their growth plates or injure them so that they aren't able to compete in their sport. This is completely false if the training is progressive, monitored and done in a safe fashion. A study by Hamill, found that weight training’s injury rate of .0012 injuries per 100 participant hours pales to the 6.2 injuries per 100 participant hours in youth soccer and 1.02 participant hours in actually playing basketball. That's right, playing baseball is at least 100X MORE likely to cause an injury than strength training (and that doesn’t even begin to take in the injury-prevention benefits of following a good strength training program). I'd rather not bother to interfere with people who will never change their mindset simply because they won't give in to any kind of information, even if it's good.
April 2, 2012
make it pretty simple i think is the important part, and mr brent does that to a T
watch eric cressey on the chart for people who are either strength focused or speed focus or the ideal inbetween position.. i know if i didnt get my lifts into a 1.5x++ bodyweight in the big lifts i wouldnt be able to do 3x/2x because i lack the power to be able to do so.. i practice extreme long toss till i hurt myself because of my own doing, i believe long tossing 300+ ft taught me the feeling of intent with results.. i also believe practicing the 3x drills is better because its more transferable and makes me feel athletic throwing the whole body in instead of traditional tossing the ball method.. you can even radar the drills and see if the gun goes up then obviously the technique or power is getting better
weight conditioning is very important, as is technique with all things, and lastly having a killer instinct mindset is critical for consistent progression which leads to results. the concept of productivity is a hard thing to grasp and often takes a bad exerience to really learn.
April 27, 2008
Drew, your injury from “Air it Out” long tossing did teach you a ton about conditioning the pitcher. You have a lot to offer this community and especially this topic here because of your experience.
You made a good point about the difference between the 3X drills and “Air it Out” long tossing. This was why I developed these throws because long toss was allowing me to turn up the intensity but at the same time it forced me to change my mechanics and abuse my rotator cuff in return. It is great to hear young guys like you finding the alternative to this conventional approach to training the pitcher which will more than likely increase your pitching longevity. Thanks for contributing to the forums!
July 1, 2011
I can’t believe I missed this debate.
Best advice I ever received. You never want to be the smartest guy in the room, if you are they expect you to have all the answers.
Mr. Bezball you are obviously the smartest guy in the room. Now I expect you to have all the answers.
When I got drafted by the Phillies out of High School I was 5’10” 151 and could throw 90+ on occassions.
How was that possible? I never had a pitching coach.
Did I lift or not?
Was it mechanics?
Was it genetics?
Brent didn’t invent pitching, he just created a better way to teach it.
If that truly bothers you then prove it wrong.
If you have a better way then I would be more than happy to put it to the test.
Just post it right HERE.
I am always looking to learn a better way to teach powerful arm healthy mechanics.
But for now Brent has my attention and my ear.
But I am always open to learn.
Coach Robo keep telling the truth and I learn something every time you post.
November 2, 2012
I just recently found out about your program and watched your three part series. I have been trying to increase my velocity like crazy lately, because I just tried out for my college team. However during the tryouts, I pitched great and didn’t give up any runs and struck out 4 through 4 innings. I thought I had the team made… But I got cut because I was around 76-78 mph and not in the 80’s. Now I have about a year to get into the 80’s before I try out again or somewhere else(not sure which yet, only a freshman). But I know I can get there, because I’m 6 foot and only 140 pounds. And I recently started hitting the gym hard lately, and I was wondering if you’d be willing to recommend some lifts to build explosiveness that I could add to my routine. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
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